Shippers, kyerupmtion and other crap
Mar. 30th, 2002 03:02 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
thebratqueenLast night I read Kita's rant about Marti Noxon and Jess's rant about shippers. They're both excellent rants so I do recommend them.
I've also got something of a related rant, so with Kita's encouragement I'm posting it here. Let's all sit down and enjoy as I go on for a bit, shall we?
First off, let's talk about Marti Noxon, David Greenwalt and the Buffy/Angel shippers. Marti, Dave - I feel your pain. Really I do. You're trying to make the shows grow and move on and you've got rabid fans cursing at you for daring to write dialogue where Buffy and Angel don't mention each other's names in every other sentence. It sucks, I get that.
However - you can't shit on the fans for doing it. Why? Because you started it!
The fans aren't pulling the "Buffy and Angel are soulmates" thing out of their asses. It was on the fucking show. It's not like the two of them shared a single significant look and an entire fandom was based off of it. It was three seasons, going on an implied four when you count the crossovers that happened when AtS got started. You told us. Granted, the "you" in question here also includes Joss himself so I'm not pointing the finger of blame solely at you two for creating this, but you have to acknowledge it. The fans aren't on crack for suggesting that maybe, just maybe, Buffy and Angel might have liked each other at some point.
Ditto the Angel/Cordy thing. David - pookie, sweetie, honey - you told us that Angel and Cordy were like brother and sister. You gave us two seasons of this. Go back and rewatch the show. It's obvious that when Angel says that he and Cordy are "family" he means it. This isn't a case of the vampire doth protest too much. Every time somebody asks Angel if he's Cordy's boyfriend he tells them no - he's family. And it's obvious to him that answer is better. So don't piss on the fans when you start up this "they've been in love the whole time" thing and we're all going "They've been what now?"
Now you've both said in repeated interviews that it's not fair to assume Angel and Buffy still hold a torch for each other after 3 years. And you know what? You're right. But this is not the way to show us that.
Let's take Angel. You, for some God-unknown reason, decide to do Angel/Cordy. I don't think this is a wise choice but for the sake of argument let's go with it. You want to show Angel being in love with someone who's not Buffy, Cordy's got a set of breasts so you pick her. Fine.
But this "destiny" thing in no way proves the point you're supposedly trying to make. "Angel needs to move on like a normal person would! So we're giving him another soul mate!" Say what?
You know there's so many things wrong with the whole kyerupmtion/Cordy's a champion/destiny thing I don't even know where to begin. So I'm not even going to start (at least for this rant). Instead I'm going to tell you how you should have done it.
'cause here's the thing - you could have done this using your own existing canon. Which is why I'm still scratching my head wondering why you didn't. Why pick this fake destiny bullshit when you don't have to?
Here's what you should have done:
When Buffy died, that should have been when Angel realized his feelings for Cordy. Not in a "Great, she's dead! Who can I obsess about next?" kind of way, but in a "Whoa - my worldview just changed." kind of way.
Buffy's death put a major shock into Angel's system. Things he took for granted - like her being alive - were yanked out from under him. This gives you the perfect time for him to return from his 3 months away and start reevaluating things.
From here you can take one of two paths.
Path one: Angel realizes his feelings for Cordy while he's away. The shock of Buffy's death strips away a lot of his assumptions and he sees that his feelings for Cordy aren't exactly sibling like. He comes back to Los Angeles shy and awkward around her, but eager to do anything to get her attention. Heartthrob can stay more or less as scripted, except when Angel sees Cordy the first time she gets the longest hug and the gift that has special meaning to her, not Wesley.
Path Two: When Angel returns from his time away he's thoughtfully reevaluating his life. He's wondering what it means to survive your soul mate and be "okay". What does "okay" mean? And what does he even want now that this burning obsession has been removed from his life? He thought he understood what love was, but maybe it's something different? Maybe he doesn't even know what any of his relationships are in the first place.
Heartthrob goes just as it did, but it gives Angel a hint on how to figure things out - the big, obsessive forever love isn't a good thing. So maybe he needs another kind. Something quieter and more day to day. He thinks about the people he feels affection for, and starts wondering if maybe he's in love with Cordy. After all - it's not like he knows. His only experience with love was Buffy, so maybe he's been getting it wrong.
In the following eps you see Angel trying to figure the him and Cordy thing out. He tries being ultra-friendly, he tries flirting, he tries seeing if she finds him attractive - he's all over the place. He's got no idea how to act on "normal" love or even if this is "normal" love, but as part of his desire to be more human he's going to give it a try.
There. You see? Seamless fit into the canon, believable extrapolation from the text, and it still proves your points no matter what you were trying to say (either Angel's passionately in love with Cordy or Angel's just trying to have a normal relationship). There is no reason at all for the "pulled it out of our asses" destiny/kyerumption shit to have been used. So why use it?
Sigh.
I've also got something of a related rant, so with Kita's encouragement I'm posting it here. Let's all sit down and enjoy as I go on for a bit, shall we?
First off, let's talk about Marti Noxon, David Greenwalt and the Buffy/Angel shippers. Marti, Dave - I feel your pain. Really I do. You're trying to make the shows grow and move on and you've got rabid fans cursing at you for daring to write dialogue where Buffy and Angel don't mention each other's names in every other sentence. It sucks, I get that.
However - you can't shit on the fans for doing it. Why? Because you started it!
The fans aren't pulling the "Buffy and Angel are soulmates" thing out of their asses. It was on the fucking show. It's not like the two of them shared a single significant look and an entire fandom was based off of it. It was three seasons, going on an implied four when you count the crossovers that happened when AtS got started. You told us. Granted, the "you" in question here also includes Joss himself so I'm not pointing the finger of blame solely at you two for creating this, but you have to acknowledge it. The fans aren't on crack for suggesting that maybe, just maybe, Buffy and Angel might have liked each other at some point.
Ditto the Angel/Cordy thing. David - pookie, sweetie, honey - you told us that Angel and Cordy were like brother and sister. You gave us two seasons of this. Go back and rewatch the show. It's obvious that when Angel says that he and Cordy are "family" he means it. This isn't a case of the vampire doth protest too much. Every time somebody asks Angel if he's Cordy's boyfriend he tells them no - he's family. And it's obvious to him that answer is better. So don't piss on the fans when you start up this "they've been in love the whole time" thing and we're all going "They've been what now?"
Now you've both said in repeated interviews that it's not fair to assume Angel and Buffy still hold a torch for each other after 3 years. And you know what? You're right. But this is not the way to show us that.
Let's take Angel. You, for some God-unknown reason, decide to do Angel/Cordy. I don't think this is a wise choice but for the sake of argument let's go with it. You want to show Angel being in love with someone who's not Buffy, Cordy's got a set of breasts so you pick her. Fine.
But this "destiny" thing in no way proves the point you're supposedly trying to make. "Angel needs to move on like a normal person would! So we're giving him another soul mate!" Say what?
You know there's so many things wrong with the whole kyerupmtion/Cordy's a champion/destiny thing I don't even know where to begin. So I'm not even going to start (at least for this rant). Instead I'm going to tell you how you should have done it.
'cause here's the thing - you could have done this using your own existing canon. Which is why I'm still scratching my head wondering why you didn't. Why pick this fake destiny bullshit when you don't have to?
Here's what you should have done:
When Buffy died, that should have been when Angel realized his feelings for Cordy. Not in a "Great, she's dead! Who can I obsess about next?" kind of way, but in a "Whoa - my worldview just changed." kind of way.
Buffy's death put a major shock into Angel's system. Things he took for granted - like her being alive - were yanked out from under him. This gives you the perfect time for him to return from his 3 months away and start reevaluating things.
From here you can take one of two paths.
Path one: Angel realizes his feelings for Cordy while he's away. The shock of Buffy's death strips away a lot of his assumptions and he sees that his feelings for Cordy aren't exactly sibling like. He comes back to Los Angeles shy and awkward around her, but eager to do anything to get her attention. Heartthrob can stay more or less as scripted, except when Angel sees Cordy the first time she gets the longest hug and the gift that has special meaning to her, not Wesley.
Path Two: When Angel returns from his time away he's thoughtfully reevaluating his life. He's wondering what it means to survive your soul mate and be "okay". What does "okay" mean? And what does he even want now that this burning obsession has been removed from his life? He thought he understood what love was, but maybe it's something different? Maybe he doesn't even know what any of his relationships are in the first place.
Heartthrob goes just as it did, but it gives Angel a hint on how to figure things out - the big, obsessive forever love isn't a good thing. So maybe he needs another kind. Something quieter and more day to day. He thinks about the people he feels affection for, and starts wondering if maybe he's in love with Cordy. After all - it's not like he knows. His only experience with love was Buffy, so maybe he's been getting it wrong.
In the following eps you see Angel trying to figure the him and Cordy thing out. He tries being ultra-friendly, he tries flirting, he tries seeing if she finds him attractive - he's all over the place. He's got no idea how to act on "normal" love or even if this is "normal" love, but as part of his desire to be more human he's going to give it a try.
There. You see? Seamless fit into the canon, believable extrapolation from the text, and it still proves your points no matter what you were trying to say (either Angel's passionately in love with Cordy or Angel's just trying to have a normal relationship). There is no reason at all for the "pulled it out of our asses" destiny/kyerumption shit to have been used. So why use it?
Sigh.
